Circumventing the RidikulusRool Peter's Evo Chopper derake...

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Prof
Founder, Choppers Australia
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Circumventing the RidikulusRool Peter's Evo Chopper derake...

Post by Prof » Thu Jun 20, 2019 9:47 pm

Peter's newly purchased machine originates from interstate and therefore needs a number check to be registered in SA.

They will check for general adherance to SA Road Rules (can't call it roadworthiness!!!) and the front end looks to be out past our nanny state's Ridikulus550Rool. A phone call and he cruises over so we can do an accurate check and come up with a solution.

RR states that distance from centre of steering head to axle centre on a horizontal plane must not exceed 550mm. Way to check this is to use a set square and ruler to find steering head centre. Then measure across to the axle.
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Hmm! 75mm too much. Axle needs to be back to the end of the aluminium ruler. Headstem bearing cups with an inbuilt 3 degree rake are available for most HD's. So question is; can we put them in backwards and bring the axle back 75mm?
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We set up a piece of 1/2" square tube at minus 3 degrees using a large protractor...
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Move second square along to where the axle will now be and it should be within a few mm either way...
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Peter will come back in a few weeks and we will give it a go, as I have the correct 3 degree cups in stock. To suit HD's without removable bearing cups the 3 degree jobbies come with a longer head stem which we will need to modify to suit the custom triple trees that come with this chopper.

If we are still 5 or so mils to far out we will shorten the spring spacers which will pull the wheel back. Don't have a lot of ground clearance, but should be sufficient. Time will tell.

One his way over Peter hit a nasty dip/hole in the tarmac and was still hurting (the air shockers leak so no rear suspension until they are replaced). To get him home more comfortably, we pulled the covering off the rear of the seat and added some new foam where the old stuff had collapsed. Gave him a call when he arrived and he said it was far more comfy. See you in a month mate.
Chopit'nrideit... Prof

El Skitzo
Posts: 774
Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2009 6:40 pm
Location: Perth, WA

Re: Circumventing the RidikulusRool...

Post by El Skitzo » Thu Jun 27, 2019 9:47 am

Hmmmm, good luck...
'65 Triumph Chopper (project)
'64 Triumph Chopper (project)

Prof
Founder, Choppers Australia
Posts: 5893
Joined: Sat Oct 22, 2005 3:54 pm
Location: Willunga, South Australia
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Re: Circumventing the RidikulusRool Peter's Evo Chopper derake...

Post by Prof » Tue Oct 08, 2019 10:39 pm

Back in the workshop for a couple of weeks and at last catching up on jobs.

A couple of quickies. Apehangers on a Hunter required lengthening 12 sets or wires, a new clutch cable, modified throttle cable and setting up a choke using a Velocette advance/retard lever. More on this in a separate post...
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New sprocket cover on Rob's sporty allowed me to build a set of pipes to his design and mount the rear brake cylinder and connect up to the forwards. More on this on his post elsewhere...
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Now an emergency job for Peter. Needs to get his bike through Regency in a hurry, so squeezed him in today and tomorrow. We previously worked out (see previous post) that 3 degree cups in reverse and dropping out spring spacers would get him back to 550 RR. He took a 3 degree kit home to install it and was stymied by a weird steering head. Seems they used a piece of solid bar and only drilled a hole thought it to just fit the 1" headstem... no room to angle the headstem absolutely zilch. Back to the drawing board.

In the meantime, I had ridden up to his place and looked at the chopper minus its fuel tank. Bodgied mess on the backbone a few inches behind the steering head = cracked backbone despite the bog covering it!!! I had previously advised him once registered to get some extra gussets or tubular support into the headstem area. What I figured was a hidden crack confirmed it. So, desperate to get the chopper registered Peter asked if I could slip in his job. Two days should cover it, so I agreed to slot him in...
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He'd taken out the old bearing cups before realising things wouldn't work so we dropped off the front end and installed new outer races and then did some measuring...
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I hoped we might be able to get back to the 550 by removing 3" of spring spacing (any more and the front would be too low) and using some standard triple trees which have half an inch less offset. He could then put it back as it was after regio if he wanted to. Alas, as you can see from the measurements we were still 18mm (3/4") too much. Peter had had enough of mucking around and said, "Let's just derake it so it meets 550.
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A close look at the bodgied bit showed a crack and shocking welding. So that piece needed to be cut out. Person in background is my new workman, Lionell who is doing well; here dismantling Garry's Twin Cam ready for us to get the motor up on my jig and then build the new frame...
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Here's the offending piece with bog and paint removed. Someone had tried to weld a piece of 1.6 mm steel around the weld!! Unbelievable!!!!!
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Ok. We have three jobs. Move the steering head forwards at the top to reduce the rake, rejoin the backbone, strengthen the whole area. Peter cleaning off paint with a flap disc. Tomorrow he'll get into the tighter parts with die grinder etc. Paint contaminates the weld, so it has to come off completely...
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Here's what we have. Will have to heat down tubes low down to do the derake or alternatively remove the piece behind the headstem and make it more like a modern goose neck. Advantage of the second method is that handlebars won't be taken so far forwards our of rider's reach...
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Here're the basics of the strengthening process. Natural tendency of backbone is to try to bow downward at around the back of the missing bit. So 1. New piece installed to fill gap (1). 2. Backbone needs to be a larger diameter for the size motor and forks this bike is carrying. This will be done with a tube with the same ID as the existing OD. It is split in two (A&B) and drilled for plug welding as well as full length welding along the cut sides. Weld along sides will both join the two pieces and tie them into the existing backbone. 3. A curved tube will be installed (C) It will also be attached to the tube that currently carried the forward tank mounts. 4. Peter wants to retain the flames at the back of the steering head, so we will just fill in the add hole inside the flames to increase weld area of frame to steering head...
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Peter will be back tomorrow for a short time and again on Thursday. I hope to get it finished by end of Thursday as I have to take off to Pt Pirie Friday. I had wanted to have my front guard done for the trip in case I meet up with a traffic cop on the way... so will just have to say my prayers on that one. Monday I can then get on with raking the VTX 1300 whose owner has been very patiently waiting.
Chopit'nrideit... Prof

Prof
Founder, Choppers Australia
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Re: Circumventing the RidikulusRool Peter's Evo Chopper derake...

Post by Prof » Thu Oct 10, 2019 9:30 pm

Back onto the chopper for a few hours the following morning. Jack the frame forwards and see what happens with 550 rule. Need 80mm, but after a fair bit of pressure only gain about 30mm. Down tubes are basically bending from near front engine mount and just doing it this way will mean pushing steering head well forwards and away from rider. Alternative if we just use jack is to heat down tubes just below steering head and create a mild gooseneck. Back bone will in both cases need to be lowered. there is another solution; drop the front end by shortening the spring spacers...
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A few measurements up the lower legs suggest major gains this way; in fact about 75 mm shorter will do it. This will also allow him to put them back later and have the kind of chopper he wants. Pull off top tree and remove nuts on top of forks. Spacers are around 250mm long...
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Use bike stand to alter bike height to get the effect and yes, does the trick... now within 550mm...
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Peter makes up some new spacers from water pipe. Make sure you scrape/blow out any residue if using old pipe...
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You can't read the ruler in this pic but with new spacers installed and chopper sits about level, still has some suspension and is at about 530mmRR...
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Rake is now 36 degrees...
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I am going to fab a curved tube to lock the backbone into a gusset between the down tubes, so front tank mount needs to be cut off. Measure up distance between mounting holes. Peter will bring tank down next time so we can reconnect the front mounts...
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Tube bent with heat to a pattern made from ally welding wire...
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Tube has a 3mm wall thickness. Have used heavier gauge than I would with a straight section, because a curved shape can flex so is not an ideal gusset even supported part way along. Extra wall thickness will give it a bit more stiffness...
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Bent and testing for fit...
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A lot of custom frames look 'killer'... and a lot of them are. Insufficient support for steering heads 'way out there'' especially with the modern massive motors and front ends and overall heaviness. I have photos of a number of custom frames that I have needed to rebuild and strengthen in this area. So we are adding a long gusset between the down tubes. Think about the twisting force when cornering at speed especially on our rough Australian roads...
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Way to get an even curve is to fold the card in half and then cut. Open it up and you have an even curve...
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3mm steel gusset is cut. See other posts for cutting out the curve. Here being finished with the angle grinder before a final touch up on a small sander I use...
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When tack welding in the gusset it needs to be straight. This is achieved by using a straight edge across the frame tubes and measuring each side with a ruler or verniers...
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Gusset welded in...
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Curved tube now final fitted. I am going to suggest to Peter that we move the flame section so a flame tip can be welded to the curve for that bit extra rigidity. It all adds up timewise, but better done once properly than a chance of it needing further work later on...
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Backbone is now squared up....
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Fitted to back of steering head...
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A short slug will be made from some hollow bar to lock in the rear of the new section. Next job then will be plating the whole backbone, which should happen Monday...
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Chopit'nrideit... Prof

El Skitzo
Posts: 774
Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2009 6:40 pm
Location: Perth, WA

Re: Circumventing the RidikulusRool Peter's Evo Chopper derake...

Post by El Skitzo » Fri Oct 11, 2019 11:33 am

Wow that's a lot of work, well done on finding a solution.

Always pays to know about the 550mm rule before buying a bike.

Great pics too, as this will all be very relevant when we chop my Triumph frame to stretch it.
'65 Triumph Chopper (project)
'64 Triumph Chopper (project)

Prof
Founder, Choppers Australia
Posts: 5893
Joined: Sat Oct 22, 2005 3:54 pm
Location: Willunga, South Australia
Contact:

Re: Circumventing the RidikulusRool Peter's Evo Chopper derake...

Post by Prof » Fri Oct 11, 2019 12:21 pm

Glad to be of assistance. That's what we are about. Looking forwards to seeing your progress...
Chopit'nrideit... Prof

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